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WayForums General Off Topic WayForward games on GoG?

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  • #4796

    .Luke
    Forwardist

    Jinpachiro, I wouldn’t waste your time arguing with Basty. He’s clearly not affected by the problems that come with DRM, so he’s waving it off as something that’s negligible, and he doesn’t understand how DRM simply does not need to exist. Valve themselves know that DRM does nothing to stop piracy in any capacity; it’s just something that looks nice on a tick box to company fat cats.

    They understand that people are going to pirate games no matter what you do to stop that, so why not offer a better service than what simply downloading the game will get you? There are so many perks to buying games on Steam, and with all the Steam sales that crop up, there’s simply no justifiable reason for somebody with pocket change to not actually buy his or her favorite games.

    I also don’t think most people even realize that some games are cracked before release day, thanks to people leaking copies of the game once it goes gold. So at the end of the day, DRM is a detriment to archival and long term storage of your games. This is where GoG comes in, and I applaud them for not stopping me from backing up my games however I want. My sense of ownership for a game is actually stronger without DRM.

    tl;dr: never treat your customers like criminals. They’re the ones that have to deal with their games suddenly not working anymore, while the pirates happily play away. That’s why services like GoG exist.

    #4798

    Yeshuash
    Forwardist

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    #4799

    Basty
    Forwardist

    @.Luke
    I am not affected by Steam’s DRM because anyone even with dial-up access to internet ain’t being affected by it and it’s not a scale of always online unlike some other services out there. If there truly were problems to a scale as people complain about and I would experience them, I would most certainly make noise about it.
    But again, as I’ve stated many times before, what you get from Steam is very little problem in comparison to scrap you get from other services.
    Want to play offline? You can play offline if the game is offline game. Want to create a backup? In Most of the cases you can make a backup, there is a function for it in there.
    Also at no point did I claim that no one couldn’t pirate the game regardless.

    Unless GOG “Pardon me, I haven’t checked if they do but I doubt that” is selling their games as physical copies, people who want to gain a legal copy of their game has to have an access to internet. At that part, what little DRM that Steam has it barely affects anyone except those who never had internet access from begin with and GOG won’t do them much good either on that regard.

    It might not do much, true. But it does the bare minimum to keep investors happy and prevent them from coming up with something even more terrible ideas that truly makes our gamer lives miserable.

    Now I would understand the big hassle if it was about console having to register console games online which shouldn’t ever be a requirement.

    #4800

    Yeshuash
    Forwardist

    Never heard of the Dark Souls 2 VAC fiasco?

    Every day people issue complaints on to steam without getting any response. Just check the steam forums.

    It’s not the issue of “I need Internet to get my game” but “I need Internet and some third party software to do anything with my game”.

    Like i said earlier you actually BUY games on GoG not just the service to play them, no third party software, you get an actual installer and not just a file cache.
    From that moment the game is your property.

    Also a back up from Steam still needs Steam to run and operate it.

    #4804

    Basty
    Forwardist

    @Yeshuash What ever extra game makes you to do in order to play it, is pretty much by devs/publisher’s decision. Only game that has required me to register in to three different places “Steam included” was Supreme Commander 2 and honestly, that was quite stupid. But it was not Steam that demanded them to do that so it is pointless to rain fire and brimstone at them on that regard since they aren’t responsible for that decision.

    Also, as far as I understand what VAC is supposed to be, it’s a hack prevention program which doesn’t have anything to do with DRM and yet again, it was devs decision to use that from begin with, not Steam’s.

    #4807

    Lorley
    Forwardist

    Dark Souls 2 is a game heavily reliant on online capability. You enter other people’s game sessions, other people enter yours. There is a boss who literally pulls players out of their own games to fight against you. This has always been part of the Souls franchise, so why are you surprised when you can’t play offline?

    And like Basty said, third party software is up to the publishers, like how Far Cry requires a UPlay account. A small independent studio like WayForward won’t require something like that, especially since Ducktales Remastered and Double Dragon Neon don’t.

    #4810

    .Luke
    Forwardist

    Dark Souls II is also fully playable offline as well. You can defeat bosses on your own just fine, (Seriously, the game isn’t designed to be hard, it simply doesn’t hold your hand, or point out the boss patterns for you.) but the online component is nice, and you get to test your characters’ strength out on other players with a little fighting on the side too.

    Basty, offline mode doesn’t work for every game, and you certainly can’t run your game backups on a new computer either without checking in with Steam first. There are times where some people are locked out of playing $100’s of dollars in games from their Steam library, sometimes for a whole week, because Steam went down. It doesn’t help when some games use third-party DRM on top of Steam Guard. Secu-ROM is nothing short of Spyware.

    Just because you are not affected by the problems DRM causes, doesn’t mean it isn’t real, or that thousands of legitimate customers don’t get locked out of their libraries for some arbitrary reason. It’s a disease for PC games that will eventually have to go away, or pirates will give people more reasons to pirate.

    Most games have always been well-equipped with some form of copy-protection, and some penalize pirates in-game by hilarious means, but a dependency on some remote server that can go down at any time is not the answer.

    #4818

    Basty
    Forwardist

    @.Luke Honestly, if Steam was that often offline and it would have hindered my gaming experience, I would have noticed it in these past 8 years I’ve been using it. I am sorry to say this but I don’t have a magical internet connection that connects in to services that are not available.

    Not to mention, if you have to reinstall your windows and stuff as often as once per week, you have a serious problem and the name of the problem is that your hard-drive is dying. Sure, Steam is down once in a while due to what ever reason “Mostly updates” but it’s not always down.

    #4824

    .Luke
    Forwardist

    You probably don’t log in to Steam often enough to notice, because I’m not the only one that’s been unable to login before, when every other site loaded normally. Essentially saying “Oh, my stuff is working just fine, so what are you complaining about?”, is turning a blind eye to the problem.

    And since it seems you’ve probably never even opened a computer before, let me fill in some blanks here. People build new PCs, or add new parts to their system frequently enough to keep up with the newest games, or do their jobs as artists. Sometimes that means replacing the hard drive with a faster, higher capacity HDD. Others also consider switching to SSDs for the OS while storing games on the old HDD. Sometimes you have to flat out replace the entire system when parts compatible with your motherboard cease production. I can forget upgrading my old desktop using DDR2 RAM without spending a pretty penny on RAM cards; supply and demand.

    You’re also leaving out users that like to customize their OSes, or distro hop. (Steam does support Linux now.) I’ve broken both Windows XP and Ubuntu multiple times before I got what I wanted out of them. It’s also no fun trying to juggle a massive branch of virtual partitions parked inside four primary partitions on a multi-boot. If you don’t manage them properly, you’re stuck reinstalling one or all of your OSes again. Nowadays I just dedicate one hard drive to Ubuntu, and one for Windows, because it’s such a pain in the neck to setup a proper dual-boot.

    tl;dr, people don’t reinstall Windows every week, but it’s certainly often enough for some to lose your Photoshop license altogether, for instance. (I recall older versions of PS only allowing 15 installations.)

    Seriously, Adobe’s not getting a single cent out of me when I have open-source art software that can not only compete with Photoshop’s toolset, but also doesn’t lock itself down at the drop of a hat. DRM is a quickly negated form of copy-protection that doesn’t effectively do what it was designed to do, and anyone who does the numbers know it.

    #4826

    Basty
    Forwardist

    @.Luke
    Never opened a PC before? What a lovely presumption.
    Dude.. Dudette… Whichever… Just because I cannot afford to update this old dust bucket ‘o mine on daily basis with latest tech and doohikies,
    it doesn’t mean I haven’t worked more than enough with these over sized calculators to know what’s going on inside that thing.
    Now I don’t know about you but people that I know don’t usually constantly update their PC;s either. Perhaps once per 2 or 4 years or so at the best.

    But yes, I do admit that I don’t bother experimenting with linux since windows has everything that I need and it’s way more trouble than it’s worth to even clown around them.
    Also… Ubuntu… There are so many linux nerds that would laugh you out of the room just for mentioning that name. 🙂
    However, I am going to give a try to Steam OS once they fix all the jinx and make it so that I can change my OS back to windows at will without having to reinstall my windows.

    aaaand again, Adobe is not Steam so you are not being affected by reinstalling your windows, linux or whatever.
    Not to mention those “pro” software cost an arm and a leg so I don’t bother with them either.
    On Steam, you get the license once and you are good to go for the rest of your life.
    Well, that is until Valve goes bankrupt “Which is very unlikely” or a meteor hits the Valve headquarters where all their servers are but I doubt that will happen in our lifetime.

    But alas, I checking out Steam’s sales pretty much on daily basis so I do notice when their servers are down and honestly, it’s not as often as you make it sound to be. Again, if there was a such a huge problem, I would have noticed it. Plus you can run Steam on offline mode whenever their servers are down.
    I don’t know what you are doing in order to make it so impossible for you to log in but if you happen to be using a firewall you want to put Steam on enabled list since that might help.

    #4829

    Yeshuash
    Forwardist

    So returning back to the subject of the topic, why putting games on GoG would be a problem?

    Also Busty, i have no problem with your opinion on the matter but please try not to be so smug about it.

    #4830

    Psyme
    Forwardist

    I never had a problem with Steam DRM. Even when I did have to reinstall Windows after I started getting the click of death, I simply copied the old common folder onto the new one, and all my games worked after logging in a single time, and can play them, even if I do lose my internet connection.

    #4831

    .Luke
    Forwardist

    I’m going to take my own advice to Jinpachiro, by not wasting my time further arguing the point with Basty. And Linus Torvalds himself uses Xubuntu at his home, so don’t waste your breath insulting the OS.

    As for GoG, they obviously have a hard time convincing publishers resell even their older games without DRM, but it’s possible. Have WayForward released any of their past games on the service before? (Licensed or original.)

    #4836

    Tekaramity
    Forwardist

    @.Luke – Nope, nothing outside of Steam for any of their releases, far as I’ve scouted. Closest to a WF game on GoG would be Shovel Knight since several ex-WF employees created it. Here’s hoping that WF themselves follow suit with….something, be that Double Dragon Neon, DuckTales Remastered, Half-Genie Hero, or so on.

    #4838

    Basty
    Forwardist

    @Yeshuash
    Smug? Hmm… If you say so. Might be old picture of me that gives you that impression.

    Anyways, I never said it would be a problem. I also have no issues against GoG if that is what you think. I love the site.
    But I did say that Wayfoward is bit too small of a company to leave their games complete out of protection against illegal distribution.

    @.Luke
    I am sure the man also has programming skills to match.
    But as far as I am aware of Xubuntu is quite a bit different from Ubuntu but other than that, I know nothing of that particular version of the OS.

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